Author Topic: Terminology  (Read 23155 times)

Offline Lolisauce

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Re: Terminology
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2015, 03:10:07 AM »
There's no reason to call a nether puppet 'ghost' because not every nether type is a ghost. It'd be difference if the Japanese type name was 幽霊 or お化け, but it isn't.

Hina - She is a 厄神 (Yakujin) which translates to Misfortune God, Disaster God, Calamity God, or a god that spreads pestilence. Since there is no Miasma type in this game, the closest thing to Miasma would be Nether/Poison. Miasma is generally associated with death. It is a bad, poisonous air that was believed to causesdeadly diseases such as black death. To go further, in Miasma theory, it was believed that this poisonous mist was filled with miasmata, or decomposed matter. Hina is a Yakujin that gathers everyone's misfortunes in nagashi-bina. In Japan there is this festival called Hinamatsuri, on which this day people send nagashi-bina dolls down a river to gather the disasters that can befall children. And in old days, people believed in miasma. In which case, one of many disasters that would befall children was sicknesses, from which 'miasma' is the cause. This is why Hina is a miasma type in TPP 1.8. Also note the fourth translation of Yakujin which is 'a god that spreads pestilence'. But as I said before, there is no miasma type in TPDP, so the closest thing is Nether/Poison.

Magan - Well Magan is found in Makai and there's lots of miasma there.

Kasen - Likely due to her ability to remove souls from the cycle of life and death entirely with her artificial arm. And her arm is also technically dead, I guess. Tbh, I don't think she should be Warrior/Nether. Though, I haven't read Wild and Horned Hermit yet, so I should really do that.

Alas, Hemo did these typings so you should really complain to him.
Yeah, Hina and Magan are the two big outstanding examples of people who don't really fit in with Ghost as a type name.  Everyone else has strong relation to ghosts or the dead, if they aren't a ghost themselves.  The only issue with Nether at this point is that as a word by itself, it doesn't actually mean anything relating to poison or death, it just means below ground.  (I didn't actually know that tbh, until my friend started throwing up dictionary definitions to me while discussing it.)

Anyway, new suggestion: Why not shoot for something more akin to Death as the type name?  冥 is dark/gloom, and has obvious connections to words relating to the afterlife, so why not just have a Death type that covers all things dead, undead, or that bring about death (miasma).  Makes sense for both the english and the jp, plus matches all of the relevant puppets from the looks of it.  Any thoughts?

And thanks, I'll talk to Hemo after I gauge the community's thoughts a bit more.

Offline ZXNova

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Re: Terminology
« Reply #16 on: February 01, 2015, 10:22:24 PM »
Well I was the one who came up with English translation name for 冥 type. I chose Nether because it a sort of implied connotation. Like the 'Nether' World, which is where much of the Nether type puppets live. This can even work for puppets that aren't necessarily dead, but are dead-like; such as Youmu, the poltergeists, tsukumogami, etc. Nether World is also synonymous with Hell, from which is where the Yama rules. Komachi and other shinigami are subjection to the yama, and well, they bring death. There's also an old hell, which is where Rin lives and she controls the evil spirits of the dead. Since Nether means 'below ground', it also can imply things that can be found 'underground', such as dead, or decomposing matter, like Yoshika. Sekibanki is a rokurokubi/nukekubi. And you know what pokemon is also a nukekubi? Misdreavus. So there's a basis for Sekibanki being a Nether type. There's also the part where everyone liked the name 'Nether' type.

Honestly, if I were to give Nether another name, I'd call Necro, Curse, Dusk, or Murk type. From which, when we were first translating this we were calling it Dusk-type but not many people liked it. So it got changed to Nether.

Offline Lolisauce

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Re: Terminology
« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2015, 03:24:46 AM »
Well I was the one who came up with English translation name for 冥 type. I chose Nether because it a sort of implied connotation. Like the 'Nether' World, which is where much of the Nether type puppets live. This can even work for puppets that aren't necessarily dead, but are dead-like; such as Youmu, the poltergeists, tsukumogami, etc. Nether World is also synonymous with Hell, from which is where the Yama rules. Komachi and other shinigami are subjection to the yama, and well, they bring death. There's also an old hell, which is where Rin lives and she controls the evil spirits of the dead. Since Nether means 'below ground', it also can imply things that can be found 'underground', such as dead, or decomposing matter, like Yoshika. Sekibanki is a rokurokubi/nukekubi. And you know what pokemon is also a nukekubi? Misdreavus. So there's a basis for Sekibanki being a Nether type. There's also the part where everyone liked the name 'Nether' type.

Honestly, if I were to give Nether another name, I'd call Necro, Curse, Dusk, or Murk type. From which, when we were first translating this we were calling it Dusk-type but not many people liked it. So it got changed to Nether.
That's some good ass explanation.  Thanks for popping in to drop that on me.  In all honesty, I feel like of the options presented, Necro feels best.  Nether is definitely better than Curse, Dusk, and Murk, but still relies too much on subtlety and indirect meanings.  That kind of thing isn't always gonna click with people, you know?