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Messages - Naļ

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1
Movesets / Re: [WIP] Dark Alice
« on: August 27, 2013, 02:47:15 AM »
This does look a lot nicer. Honestly lol, it's almost professional already.

I think this can stop being a WIP as soon as you finish playing with the
NEW TECHNOLOGY


There are also some minor grammar mistakes here and there, but eh.

2
Teambuilding / Re: I dunno what to call this team lol
« on: August 27, 2013, 02:31:57 AM »
Considering you pretty much have a dedicated phazer in DTenshi, Roar might be unnecessary on AdMeirin. Maybe you should consider using Strength on her instead.

Consider Psycho Cut for Goliath: we have Gen III crit mechanics, which means crit-boosted moves actually have +2 crit (in other words, a raw 25% chance). Taking that into consideration and doing some weird math, it'll actually hit for more than an 80 BP move in average.

Tailwind is a better boosting move for Goliath than SD. Also, there's not much point in running Band on her - you're probably better off relying on set up and going for the coverage instead. Fury Cutter is probably not too useful, too.

Knock Off and Trick are rather uncommon here - that, and losing the band could be beneficial to Goliath, not detrimental. Otherwise, if you're never going to use SD/Tailwind on her anyway, consider running another Band user; there are better users of it, like priority users (AdLetty), Tech Aya, etc.



I tried running Lily Black as a dedicated passer earlier, and I just plain failed at it - that, and my team was built revolving around her even more than this one. Just saying. The speed boosts are less useful than you'd think :<

Still, it's not like the dedicated passer set is the only one Lily-B can run, anyway. Taunt is useful, and you could try making use of SD yourself before passing, too; perhaps Soar instead of Detect and Atk investment?



Some of your EV spreads are honestly odd. Lily Black has a very weird spread, for example: she's too frail to be able to take hits unless you run full investment on a single defense + HP, and even then she won't take hits well on that side of the spectrum. Also, you probably really want Spd on SYorihime instead of HP, and instead of trying to rely on AdMeirin as a mixed wall, it's probably best to give her full SDef investment and couple that with a dedicated phys wall instead.

Some of the items are odd, too. Why Lum on DTenshi if you even have clerical support? She'd really appreciate the Leftovers recovery instead. SYorihime has no business with Scope Lens, either - in this case, you're probably better off with a type-boosting item, since they do boost 20% here (yep), giving you a reliable, yet very strong attack option.

3
Movesets / Re: List of Analyses
« on: August 26, 2013, 04:25:51 PM »
You never know. Maybe LC will actually become a thing once we have a metagame?
(drunk)

But yeah, 100% of the priority should be on the other sets, at least right now. Maybe LC sets could be useful in the future though.

4
Okay, then let's just make a basic one for now :<
I don't think speed variations should be included though, other than stuff like Tailwind and AMurasa/AMinoriko. Not right now, at least.

5
The only real Subseeder user we have right now is SMedicine... that counts as "horrifically short on". The same goes for mixed attackers, mixed walls (Yoshika and Lily White, that's it) and fast walls (uh, Aya?).

We do have some bulky attackers; rather than not having any, it's more like there are TOO MANY that we have no idea of how to use. Just look at half of the attack forms...

There are also too many puppets who only ever get use in one specific form. I've yet to see any Attack or Tech Medicines; that, and I only saw vanilla Medicine once, and the role she was playing in could've been done better by SMedicine, which means there probably wasn't much thought put into it.



Also, the general opinion about ~70% of the PC-98 characters is that they either suck, are completely outclassed or are just too hard to use/not worth the trouble. There are notable exceptions, like Konn, Mima, Sara, Magic Stones and Elis, but the fact stands that many of those characters are still completely unknown.

6
Shoddy Touhoumon Info/Discussion / Re: Temporary Shoddy 1 server
« on: August 24, 2013, 11:40:00 PM »
In case anyone built a team on Shoddy 1, it's possible to port it to Shoddy 2 by simply loading it there; from there, you can re-save it on Shoddy 2 format and have it be analyzed by the team analyzer, for example.

Just watch out for small compatibility issues: for example, the "None" option for Shoddy 1 items is different from Shoddy 2's, as well as the Swimsuit (it's called School Swimsuit in S1) and some moves, such as Dust Shoot/Gunk Shot.

If any of those issues are present, then the team won't load properly in Shoddy 2, and you have to go back to Shoddy 1 and change it there; the teambuilder should work even if the server isn't up.



(Also note that, while you can port from S1 to S2, you can't directly port S2 teams to S1, but I don't think anyone wants to right now :< )

7
Movesets / Re: Lily White
« on: August 24, 2013, 08:57:42 PM »
Quote from: Shanks
Lily*
AFAIK, Lilly is actually a valid spelling for Lily White/Black, though the official spelling opts for a single "l".

8
go back to bed

No, I don't really think so...
IMHO there is a major problem with your proposition.
Define OU.



The current OU is based only on usage stats, which honestly aren't the most significant factor ever. In terms of usability, the tier will only expand and expand. There are many mons largely untested; as such, it is impossible to tell whether they work or not by only looking at their pages and imagining sets, or before trying every possible option without having a "this mon is bad why am i doing this" mentality.

As such, it is not well-defined enough, simply because there's still a lot to do.

Quote from: Josh
We're really only set for derp252/252 sweepers and walls at the moment.

We're still pretty horrifically short on

Tricky utility things: Sub/Disable/Split/Seed/Status/Etc, Stallbreakers, leads, antileads, spinblockers, spinners, spikers, clerics, lures, fast passers
Bulky attackers in general: Speed creeping or just EVing these can be a bitch
Mixed attackers: Same as the above but even more annoying
Mixed Walls/Fast Walls: Annoying as Hell to EV but a metagame staple

Once threads are up for all these things and we can vanquish the great beast known as Idle Zone we can probably establish a dedicated meta through useage.
This should probably be our current priority. There's not much point in trying to make a threatlist right now, and even when we do have a meta, mon categories probably come first (because teambuilding).

9
Shoddy Touhoumon Info/Discussion / Re: Touhoumon Damage Calc
« on: August 24, 2013, 07:45:59 PM »

How many Puppets do we have that use alternate speed spreads? Thinking of editing sets in the speed calc.

Everything that runs any speed at all aside from 90 base tailwinders and 55 base speed agi/weather users with only 1 viable set. :3
^ This.
Most mons have the option of running specific Speed EVs to outrun certain threats. Easy examples are base 100~105s running just enough to outrun Jolly base 95 and putting the rest in bulk, or offensive spinners running just enough to outrun Jolly ASuwa, or...

...you get the point.
There's actually a hell of a lot of viable variation in Speed EVs (just look at Josh's recent sets!); it's just that the only well-known mons we use are the dumb ones who run 252/252, because nobody wants to test something that's hard to EV due to everyone being lazy.

Well no, it's not that extreme, but you should probably forget about this for now. That's something to be done when we actually have a metagame to begin with.







If I may make a suggestion about the damage calc, not knowing the +s and -s on each nature is annoying. Wouldn't it be easier if the positives and negatives were specified between brackets, and if natures were organized according to the positive parameter, instead of them being in alphabetical order?

10
Creative Conundrum / Re: Shard Forms You Wished Existed But Don't Exist
« on: August 24, 2013, 07:35:12 PM »
Quote from: Naļ
on purpose to lure them out and pivot from there
TToyo isn't a pivot, she's a bulky attacker (unless you know they have a Nature). They work differently.

Okay, now I'll stop talking because this is supposed to be a discussion about undefined fantastic shard forms.

11
Shoddy Touhoumon Info/Discussion / Re: Touhoumon Damage Calc
« on: August 23, 2013, 04:38:12 PM »
Hey, pretty neat, too. Thanks yet again.

If I might make a suggestion, though, is it possible for someone (Exs) to add links back and forth between both calculators? That'd make navigation far easier, and it's something pretty simple to do (I think).

12
Creative Conundrum / Re: Shard Forms You Wished Existed But Don't Exist
« on: August 23, 2013, 04:33:43 PM »
If she did exist, then she probably would get Hyper Voice. Most Dream special attackers get that as their main special Dream STAB, even if they're not a voice-related character; either that or they don't get STAB for Dream at all.
Well, other than Koishi anyway

Same thing with Binding Voice being used by special Beast attackers who'd have no reason to learn it otherwise.



And hey, what's so bad about vanilla Gengetsu? Steel moves/types are as obvious as Nature against TToyo, so you can use her on purpose to lure them out and pivot from there - she gets Reflect for that, too. And when something doesn't have Steel moves, she can work as a pretty damn fast bulky mon (if not the fastest mon with actual bulk any bigger than 80~100s).

Not that 80~100s aren't usable for some fast defensive mons, like vanilla Aya, but that's not the point.

13
Movesets / Re: Speed Lily Black
« on: August 22, 2013, 10:13:25 PM »
I'm probably not in the position to say this, but isn't this one a WIP?

14
ROM Hacks + General Discussion / Re: Movesets organization?
« on: August 22, 2013, 07:54:16 PM »
The idea isn't really giving each puppet a role; rather, it's about giving each role some puppets to work with. That's because, in teambuilding, a specific role is often what's required - in that case, one could just look for that specific category, then compare the mons in it and choose the one best suited for their team.



Doesnt's sticky thread is handy for navigation if you're looking for a specific puppet. However, as I said just now, that is often not the case. In that case, maybe it could be better to make those categories in Doesnt's thread in the future instead?

(Maybe make it a double post, one with the puppets listed per category and another one with them listed alphabetically?)

15
ROM Hacks + General Discussion / Movesets organization?
« on: August 22, 2013, 07:07:27 PM »
First of all, I'm aware we don't have an established metagame yet, but, if movesets are eventually made for most (if not all) mons, then... wouldn't this section be seriously crowded? It actually already is a bit crowded, imho.

What I mean is, couldn't there be some form of categorization for the sets later - as in, sweeper, supporter and so on? This would make it easier for both teambuilding and organization.

Also, if a mon can work in more than one category, it'd probably be convenient to leave a copy of the thread in every applicable category (meaning Tenma would be in all categories).

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